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	<title>Comments on: Rick Joyner : Lee Grady : Todd Bentley Divorce : Charisma Article</title>
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	<link>http://johnburton.net/blog/2009/03/rick-joyner-lee-grady-todd-bentley-divorce-charisma-article/</link>
	<description>The prophetic ministry of John and Amy Burton</description>
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		<title>By: Baffled</title>
		<link>http://johnburton.net/blog/2009/03/rick-joyner-lee-grady-todd-bentley-divorce-charisma-article/comment-page-1/#comment-472</link>
		<dc:creator>Baffled</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Jan 2010 23:37:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://r180.com/blog/?p=791#comment-472</guid>
		<description>Wow!  I am truly awed by the scale of delusional thinking here.  As long as Todd gets to proclaim and determine his own &quot;authority,&quot; guess what? He WILL!  Is there any common sense available in your part of the world?  I think I&#039;ll just kick back and let &quot;God take charge.&quot;  Let&#039;s see if that works any better today than it has for the last 3000 years.  I won&#039;t be holding my breath, though.  Watching Doctor Who makes more sense. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow!  I am truly awed by the scale of delusional thinking here.  As long as Todd gets to proclaim and determine his own &quot;authority,&quot; guess what? He WILL!  Is there any common sense available in your part of the world?  I think I&#039;ll just kick back and let &quot;God take charge.&quot;  Let&#039;s see if that works any better today than it has for the last 3000 years.  I won&#039;t be holding my breath, though.  Watching Doctor Who makes more sense.</p>
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		<title>By: John Burton</title>
		<link>http://johnburton.net/blog/2009/03/rick-joyner-lee-grady-todd-bentley-divorce-charisma-article/comment-page-1/#comment-166</link>
		<dc:creator>John Burton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Aug 2009 23:41:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://r180.com/blog/?p=791#comment-166</guid>
		<description>Rick did address something very important.  We don&#039;t have the right to haphazardly announce our negative critiques of another person.  There is appropriate biblical protocol for that, appropriate authority structures to consider.  For me to rip at someone whom I have no direct relationship is irresponsible.  &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Now, does Todd&#039;s authority have a right and responsibility to bring correction?  Yes.  Without question.  However, though we may have concerns, the rest of us must humbly pray and intercede and serve the process of healing and restoration.  To do so doesn&#039;t condone sin, but rather, it ministers to the one who fell into sin.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;The letter you read from Rick was supposed to be private, between him and Lee... but, for some reason, Lee took the liberty to share it publicly.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rick did address something very important.  We don&#39;t have the right to haphazardly announce our negative critiques of another person.  There is appropriate biblical protocol for that, appropriate authority structures to consider.  For me to rip at someone whom I have no direct relationship is irresponsible.  </p>
<p>Now, does Todd&#39;s authority have a right and responsibility to bring correction?  Yes.  Without question.  However, though we may have concerns, the rest of us must humbly pray and intercede and serve the process of healing and restoration.  To do so doesn&#39;t condone sin, but rather, it ministers to the one who fell into sin.</p>
<p>The letter you read from Rick was supposed to be private, between him and Lee&#8230; but, for some reason, Lee took the liberty to share it publicly.</p>
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		<title>By: John Burton</title>
		<link>http://johnburton.net/blog/2009/03/rick-joyner-lee-grady-todd-bentley-divorce-charisma-article/comment-page-1/#comment-315</link>
		<dc:creator>John Burton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Aug 2009 20:41:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://r180.com/blog/?p=791#comment-315</guid>
		<description>Rick did address something very important.  We don&#039;t have the right to haphazardly announce our negative critiques of another person.  There is appropriate biblical protocol for that, appropriate authority structures to consider.  For me to rip at someone whom I have no direct relationship is irresponsible.  &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Now, does Todd&#039;s authority have a right and responsibility to bring correction?  Yes.  Without question.  However, though we may have concerns, the rest of us must humbly pray and intercede and serve the process of healing and restoration.  To do so doesn&#039;t condone sin, but rather, it ministers to the one who fell into sin.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;The letter you read from Rick was supposed to be private, between him and Lee... but, for some reason, Lee took the liberty to share it publicly.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rick did address something very important.  We don&#39;t have the right to haphazardly announce our negative critiques of another person.  There is appropriate biblical protocol for that, appropriate authority structures to consider.  For me to rip at someone whom I have no direct relationship is irresponsible.  </p>
<p>Now, does Todd&#39;s authority have a right and responsibility to bring correction?  Yes.  Without question.  However, though we may have concerns, the rest of us must humbly pray and intercede and serve the process of healing and restoration.  To do so doesn&#39;t condone sin, but rather, it ministers to the one who fell into sin.</p>
<p>The letter you read from Rick was supposed to be private, between him and Lee&#8230; but, for some reason, Lee took the liberty to share it publicly.</p>
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		<title>By: JonBartlett</title>
		<link>http://johnburton.net/blog/2009/03/rick-joyner-lee-grady-todd-bentley-divorce-charisma-article/comment-page-1/#comment-165</link>
		<dc:creator>JonBartlett</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Aug 2009 18:23:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://r180.com/blog/?p=791#comment-165</guid>
		<description>I just read Lee Grady&#039;s article and you know what, Lee was right, and was actually far more gracious than Rick was. But of course, Lee hasn&#039;t led a move of God so how dare he?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just read Lee Grady&#39;s article and you know what, Lee was right, and was actually far more gracious than Rick was. But of course, Lee hasn&#39;t led a move of God so how dare he?</p>
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		<title>By: JonBartlett</title>
		<link>http://johnburton.net/blog/2009/03/rick-joyner-lee-grady-todd-bentley-divorce-charisma-article/comment-page-1/#comment-164</link>
		<dc:creator>JonBartlett</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Aug 2009 18:08:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://r180.com/blog/?p=791#comment-164</guid>
		<description>Now, granted I have not read Lee&#039;s article, but I noticed what Rick was saying in his in first paragraph: &quot;If you are such judge of this what gives you the credentials? What moves of God have you led? What have you built? Paul the apostle claimed to have authority for building and for tearing down, but what gives you authority to tear down the work of others is having built something yourself.&quot;&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;It looks like he&#039;s saying, &quot;only we can say anything about Lakeland or Todd, you can&#039;t because you are not up here at our level.&quot; So, because I haven&#039;t led a big ministry, I can&#039;t express any wrongs I see or discern? I thought God can use anyone, but I guess I was wrong. These people want prophets to rise up but then say they have no authority to speak because they might not like what they say. My question to Rick is how big of a ministry or move of God do I have to lead in order to earn the right to say anything critical?&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;On another note I keep seeing people saying how Todd was under pressure and attacks from so many demons and critics and he had so much responsibility. Let&#039;s say for a second that I fall into the same sin. I haven&#039;t led a movement of that magnitude or faced those kinds of pressures, so is my sin more heinous than Todd&#039;s because of that? It makes me sick because when you really look at it everyone has made Todd a martyr for falling into sin.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Now, granted I have not read Lee&#39;s article, but I noticed what Rick was saying in his in first paragraph: &#8220;If you are such judge of this what gives you the credentials? What moves of God have you led? What have you built? Paul the apostle claimed to have authority for building and for tearing down, but what gives you authority to tear down the work of others is having built something yourself.&#8221;</p>
<p>It looks like he&#39;s saying, &#8220;only we can say anything about Lakeland or Todd, you can&#39;t because you are not up here at our level.&#8221; So, because I haven&#39;t led a big ministry, I can&#39;t express any wrongs I see or discern? I thought God can use anyone, but I guess I was wrong. These people want prophets to rise up but then say they have no authority to speak because they might not like what they say. My question to Rick is how big of a ministry or move of God do I have to lead in order to earn the right to say anything critical?</p>
<p>On another note I keep seeing people saying how Todd was under pressure and attacks from so many demons and critics and he had so much responsibility. Let&#39;s say for a second that I fall into the same sin. I haven&#39;t led a movement of that magnitude or faced those kinds of pressures, so is my sin more heinous than Todd&#39;s because of that? It makes me sick because when you really look at it everyone has made Todd a martyr for falling into sin.</p>
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		<title>By: JonBartlett</title>
		<link>http://johnburton.net/blog/2009/03/rick-joyner-lee-grady-todd-bentley-divorce-charisma-article/comment-page-1/#comment-314</link>
		<dc:creator>JonBartlett</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Aug 2009 15:23:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://r180.com/blog/?p=791#comment-314</guid>
		<description>I just read Lee Grady&#039;s article and you know what, Lee was right, and was actually far more gracious than Rick was. But of course, Lee hasn&#039;t led a move of God so how dare he?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just read Lee Grady&#39;s article and you know what, Lee was right, and was actually far more gracious than Rick was. But of course, Lee hasn&#39;t led a move of God so how dare he?</p>
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		<title>By: JonBartlett</title>
		<link>http://johnburton.net/blog/2009/03/rick-joyner-lee-grady-todd-bentley-divorce-charisma-article/comment-page-1/#comment-313</link>
		<dc:creator>JonBartlett</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Aug 2009 15:08:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://r180.com/blog/?p=791#comment-313</guid>
		<description>Now, granted I have not read Lee&#039;s article, but I noticed what Rick was saying in his in first paragraph: &quot;If you are such judge of this what gives you the credentials? What moves of God have you led? What have you built? Paul the apostle claimed to have authority for building and for tearing down, but what gives you authority to tear down the work of others is having built something yourself.&quot;&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;It looks like he&#039;s saying, &quot;only we can say anything about Lakeland or Todd, you can&#039;t because you are not up here at our level.&quot; So, because I haven&#039;t led a big ministry, I can&#039;t express any wrongs I see or discern? I thought God can use anyone, but I guess I was wrong. These people want prophets to rise up but then say they have no authority to speak because they might not like what they say. My question to Rick is how big of a ministry or move of God do I have to lead in order to earn the right to say anything critical?&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;On another note I keep seeing people saying how Todd was under pressure and attacks from so many demons and critics and he had so much responsibility. Let&#039;s say for a second that I fall into the same sin. I haven&#039;t led a movement of that magnitude or faced those kinds of pressures, so is my sin more heinous than Todd&#039;s because of that? It makes me sick because when you really look at it everyone has made Todd a martyr for falling into sin.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Now, granted I have not read Lee&#39;s article, but I noticed what Rick was saying in his in first paragraph: &#8220;If you are such judge of this what gives you the credentials? What moves of God have you led? What have you built? Paul the apostle claimed to have authority for building and for tearing down, but what gives you authority to tear down the work of others is having built something yourself.&#8221;</p>
<p>It looks like he&#39;s saying, &#8220;only we can say anything about Lakeland or Todd, you can&#39;t because you are not up here at our level.&#8221; So, because I haven&#39;t led a big ministry, I can&#39;t express any wrongs I see or discern? I thought God can use anyone, but I guess I was wrong. These people want prophets to rise up but then say they have no authority to speak because they might not like what they say. My question to Rick is how big of a ministry or move of God do I have to lead in order to earn the right to say anything critical?</p>
<p>On another note I keep seeing people saying how Todd was under pressure and attacks from so many demons and critics and he had so much responsibility. Let&#39;s say for a second that I fall into the same sin. I haven&#39;t led a movement of that magnitude or faced those kinds of pressures, so is my sin more heinous than Todd&#39;s because of that? It makes me sick because when you really look at it everyone has made Todd a martyr for falling into sin.</p>
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		<title>By: Tony Davis</title>
		<link>http://johnburton.net/blog/2009/03/rick-joyner-lee-grady-todd-bentley-divorce-charisma-article/comment-page-1/#comment-163</link>
		<dc:creator>Tony Davis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Apr 2009 02:08:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://r180.com/blog/?p=791#comment-163</guid>
		<description>Beloved Sister,&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;I was reading your post, and allow me to  say, what a complete opinion you presented.  You showed no partiality nor biasness, as we are to study the &quot;whole&quot; counsel of God, so have you presented yourself on this topic of discussion.  I discerned no narrow mindness w/you, but only a desire to see things as they are, especially when you said &quot;fruit inspectors&quot;, for we know the Lord said, &quot;a tree will be known by its fruit, can a good tree bring forth bad fruit, and can a bad tree bring forth good fruit.&quot;  I saw you mention accountability and responsibility on both sides of the fence, not just the one you might&#039;ve showed favoritism with.  And your mentioning of the great apostasy (which was beginning during the times of the Apostles) showed your understanding of the condition of the present condition of the church outlined by Christ himself in the bk of Rev.  I have edified you enough (smile) continue allowing the Lord, to open your heart and mind to his word, will, and wisdom.  May blessings be upon you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Beloved Sister,</p>
<p>I was reading your post, and allow me to  say, what a complete opinion you presented.  You showed no partiality nor biasness, as we are to study the &#8220;whole&#8221; counsel of God, so have you presented yourself on this topic of discussion.  I discerned no narrow mindness w/you, but only a desire to see things as they are, especially when you said &#8220;fruit inspectors&#8221;, for we know the Lord said, &#8220;a tree will be known by its fruit, can a good tree bring forth bad fruit, and can a bad tree bring forth good fruit.&#8221;  I saw you mention accountability and responsibility on both sides of the fence, not just the one you might&#39;ve showed favoritism with.  And your mentioning of the great apostasy (which was beginning during the times of the Apostles) showed your understanding of the condition of the present condition of the church outlined by Christ himself in the bk of Rev.  I have edified you enough (smile) continue allowing the Lord, to open your heart and mind to his word, will, and wisdom.  May blessings be upon you.</p>
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		<title>By: Tony Davis</title>
		<link>http://johnburton.net/blog/2009/03/rick-joyner-lee-grady-todd-bentley-divorce-charisma-article/comment-page-1/#comment-307</link>
		<dc:creator>Tony Davis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Apr 2009 23:08:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://r180.com/blog/?p=791#comment-307</guid>
		<description>Beloved Sister,&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;I was reading your post, and allow me to  say, what a complete opinion you presented.  You showed no partiality nor biasness, as we are to study the &quot;whole&quot; counsel of God, so have you presented yourself on this topic of discussion.  I discerned no narrow mindness w/you, but only a desire to see things as they are, especially when you said &quot;fruit inspectors&quot;, for we know the Lord said, &quot;a tree will be known by its fruit, can a good tree bring forth bad fruit, and can a bad tree bring forth good fruit.&quot;  I saw you mention accountability and responsibility on both sides of the fence, not just the one you might&#039;ve showed favoritism with.  And your mentioning of the great apostasy (which was beginning during the times of the Apostles) showed your understanding of the condition of the present condition of the church outlined by Christ himself in the bk of Rev.  I have edified you enough (smile) continue allowing the Lord, to open your heart and mind to his word, will, and wisdom.  May blessings be upon you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Beloved Sister,</p>
<p>I was reading your post, and allow me to  say, what a complete opinion you presented.  You showed no partiality nor biasness, as we are to study the &#8220;whole&#8221; counsel of God, so have you presented yourself on this topic of discussion.  I discerned no narrow mindness w/you, but only a desire to see things as they are, especially when you said &#8220;fruit inspectors&#8221;, for we know the Lord said, &#8220;a tree will be known by its fruit, can a good tree bring forth bad fruit, and can a bad tree bring forth good fruit.&#8221;  I saw you mention accountability and responsibility on both sides of the fence, not just the one you might&#39;ve showed favoritism with.  And your mentioning of the great apostasy (which was beginning during the times of the Apostles) showed your understanding of the condition of the present condition of the church outlined by Christ himself in the bk of Rev.  I have edified you enough (smile) continue allowing the Lord, to open your heart and mind to his word, will, and wisdom.  May blessings be upon you.</p>
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		<title>By: Tony Davis</title>
		<link>http://johnburton.net/blog/2009/03/rick-joyner-lee-grady-todd-bentley-divorce-charisma-article/comment-page-1/#comment-162</link>
		<dc:creator>Tony Davis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Apr 2009 03:24:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://r180.com/blog/?p=791#comment-162</guid>
		<description>Dear Ones&#039;,&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;We remember how the Apostle Paul wanted the church at Corinth to handle the situation w/the young man who had fell into sin, because they had ignored his blatant sin, then we read according to 2d Corinthians they went overboard in there discipline and Paul urged them to receive him back.  Now of course this young brother had appeared unrepentant, for which we hear and some have witnessed Bro. Todd repentant publicly, but in the end only the Lord knows, let us remember man looks on the outward appearance but the Lord looks on and examines the heart.  We all have differing opinions on this situation, but let us agree on one thing that sin has consequences, whether we like the consequence or not its a consequence nonetheless, its not about condoning the slander and gossip but understanding the reasons.  God told the children of Israel according to the bk of Lev, &quot;when you stop acting like the chastisement I have brought upon you is some strange thing, and come to your senses about your sin, then will I deliver and restore you.&quot;  My point is friends, you defuse the slandering and gossiping w/accountability and responsibility not acting like some strange thing is going on when we sin and people get a hold of it (saved or heathen).  When they were accusing the Lord (who already knew who he was and where he was going back to) never said a word and then like Paul according to the bk of Acts we have to defend ourselves, but of course the (2) I speak of were innocent of the accusations.  To those who are continuously slandering and gossiping about Bro. Todd perhaps let us examine the scripture when the Lord said, &quot;those of you without sin, be the first to cast the stone&quot; and let us who feel we need to rush to the defense, yes support our brother or brothers&#039; who have fallen into sin, but also help them to be accountable and responsible and recognize we reap what we have sowed, if you sow to the flesh you shall reap of the flesh and most of the time when we fall into sin its not going to have positive consequences, the consequence many times will be painful and discouraging, but when we say according to the bk of Micah, &quot;I will bear the indignation of the Lord, for I have sinned against him&quot;, then friends regardless of what anyone says the cleansing and restoration will most definetely begin.  Then we will say as David did, &quot;Restore unto me the joy of your salvation oh LORD and give me a willing spirit to sustain me, then will I teach transgessors your ways (be a testimony of what to do and not to do) and sinners will come back to you.&quot;  I&#039;m sure the nation of Israel and all the nations around Israel, slandered and gossiped to know end about David&#039;s sin w/Bathesheba, but inspite of God cleansed and washed him, because David manfully accepted and understood the consequences of what he brought on himslef, his family and the nation, he did not seek the understanding or the forgiveness of man, but sought the understanding and forgiveness of a merciful God (who delights in mercy) but also must judge sin in whatever manner he choses to mature us into not making the same mistake again.  David and Jacob, both teach us the consequences of sin are many times unending, yes God&#039;s anger is but for a moment and he always looks to restore his wayward children &quot;I&#039;m married to the backslider&quot; but the consequences of our sin are unavoidable.  I believe God expects us to manfully understand the consequences of our sin deal w/what we&#039;ve brought on ourselves, asking him to grant us the grace to deal w/the backlash that many times is brought onto us by him, remember what he said to David, &quot;I will raise up evil against you out of your own house&quot; and let him silence the defamers in time.  Loving you all.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear Ones&#39;,</p>
<p>We remember how the Apostle Paul wanted the church at Corinth to handle the situation w/the young man who had fell into sin, because they had ignored his blatant sin, then we read according to 2d Corinthians they went overboard in there discipline and Paul urged them to receive him back.  Now of course this young brother had appeared unrepentant, for which we hear and some have witnessed Bro. Todd repentant publicly, but in the end only the Lord knows, let us remember man looks on the outward appearance but the Lord looks on and examines the heart.  We all have differing opinions on this situation, but let us agree on one thing that sin has consequences, whether we like the consequence or not its a consequence nonetheless, its not about condoning the slander and gossip but understanding the reasons.  God told the children of Israel according to the bk of Lev, &#8220;when you stop acting like the chastisement I have brought upon you is some strange thing, and come to your senses about your sin, then will I deliver and restore you.&#8221;  My point is friends, you defuse the slandering and gossiping w/accountability and responsibility not acting like some strange thing is going on when we sin and people get a hold of it (saved or heathen).  When they were accusing the Lord (who already knew who he was and where he was going back to) never said a word and then like Paul according to the bk of Acts we have to defend ourselves, but of course the (2) I speak of were innocent of the accusations.  To those who are continuously slandering and gossiping about Bro. Todd perhaps let us examine the scripture when the Lord said, &#8220;those of you without sin, be the first to cast the stone&#8221; and let us who feel we need to rush to the defense, yes support our brother or brothers&#39; who have fallen into sin, but also help them to be accountable and responsible and recognize we reap what we have sowed, if you sow to the flesh you shall reap of the flesh and most of the time when we fall into sin its not going to have positive consequences, the consequence many times will be painful and discouraging, but when we say according to the bk of Micah, &#8220;I will bear the indignation of the Lord, for I have sinned against him&#8221;, then friends regardless of what anyone says the cleansing and restoration will most definetely begin.  Then we will say as David did, &#8220;Restore unto me the joy of your salvation oh LORD and give me a willing spirit to sustain me, then will I teach transgessors your ways (be a testimony of what to do and not to do) and sinners will come back to you.&#8221;  I&#39;m sure the nation of Israel and all the nations around Israel, slandered and gossiped to know end about David&#39;s sin w/Bathesheba, but inspite of God cleansed and washed him, because David manfully accepted and understood the consequences of what he brought on himslef, his family and the nation, he did not seek the understanding or the forgiveness of man, but sought the understanding and forgiveness of a merciful God (who delights in mercy) but also must judge sin in whatever manner he choses to mature us into not making the same mistake again.  David and Jacob, both teach us the consequences of sin are many times unending, yes God&#39;s anger is but for a moment and he always looks to restore his wayward children &#8220;I&#39;m married to the backslider&#8221; but the consequences of our sin are unavoidable.  I believe God expects us to manfully understand the consequences of our sin deal w/what we&#39;ve brought on ourselves, asking him to grant us the grace to deal w/the backlash that many times is brought onto us by him, remember what he said to David, &#8220;I will raise up evil against you out of your own house&#8221; and let him silence the defamers in time.  Loving you all.</p>
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